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  #1  
Old 11-23-2012, 07:51 PM
cocoy1805 cocoy1805 is offline
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Default personal curiosity about 29er..

to the gurus and experts out there.. i have a question.. that probably doesnt make sense.. well it sure is raising my curiosity.. here goes..

i have read and seen comparisons on the 26" vs 29". im just wondering why hasnt the motorcyle world adopted the 26" or 29" wheels if indeed bigger is better?

is it because they dont need to worry about weight and acceleration problems? if indeed a 29er has better maneuverability, why hasnt the motrocross world switched?

Mods sori if this is OT.. im just really curious..
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  #2  
Old 11-23-2012, 10:04 PM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

i ll try. maybe because the medium that you mentioned are powered by engines. and since most of the weight are already on the engine, they need to cut weight somewhere else.

i dont think 29er has better maneuverability. maybe more stable?
  #3  
Old 11-23-2012, 10:22 PM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

when comparing 26 and 29 inch wheels, bigger doesn't necessarily better, each has advantages and disadvantages. smaller diameter wheels are stiffer and stronger while bigger is flexy but has better stability and roll over. when you apply this to motorcycle, imagine the motocross bike, the wheel in front is bigger than the rear, why? because bigger wheel has tendency to toll over obstacles. the rear wheel is designed to be smaller to obtain stronger build to withstand the hi torque of engine and better acceleration.

as far as i know, smaller wheel has better maneuverability than bigger wheels. you'll notice there is no 29'ner on DH races due to maneuverability issue and wheel strength.
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Old 11-24-2012, 09:59 AM
cocoy1805 cocoy1805 is offline
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

thank you sirs for your response.. my cousin is a downhiller too.and he said basically the same about down hill bikes.. im just wondering then whats all the craze about 29er MTB..

at the moment my MTB has 26" 2.3 tires.. and actually its bigger than the average 2.3 tire.. as we all know some tires have different sizes even when they have the same size stated..

would the 2.3 tire equal 27" in diameter? when its added to the 26" rims? i always joke that i dont need to go the new 27.5 rim size as im close enough already. heheh.. i know in some other things in life 3" can make a big diffences.. does it make that big of a difference on tire sizes? especially on MTBs?

thanks again guys..
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Old 11-24-2012, 10:45 AM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

@cocoy: sir parang dati nasukat ko ung rim ng 26", hindi ito 26", pag sinama ko sa sukat ang tire na 2.1" ay almost sakto na sa 26".. ganun din siguro sa 29er at 27.5". ill double check later after work.
  #6  
Old 11-24-2012, 11:48 AM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

@cocoy -- It's a complex issue. In motorcycles, you have an engine, and you don't use motorcycles for singletrack. You can't directly compare them. 29er's are not more maneuverable than 26er's in general and it was never said that 29er wheels are also good for motorcycles.

I don't believe you can "cheat" and get a 27.5" wheel by putting huge tires on a 26". The dynamics are different. It's still about rotating weight. A 2.5 DH 26er tire will probably weigh more than a kilogram. Compare that to a 2.1 27.5" trail tire that weighs 550 grams or so. There is a huge difference in the outermost rotating mass. Weight difference between both sizes of rims will probably be less than 50 grams. The contact patch of a huge, small diameter tire will also be different from a mid-size, larger diameter tire. The 27.5 will get a slightly longer contact patch, resulting in more stability and rollover capacity in theory. In the end, you will get a faster rolling wheel, but with greater momentum, with only a slight penalty in maneuverability. I think 27.5 will be great for shorter riders, or taller riders riding bikes with >5 inch travel.
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Old 11-24-2012, 02:03 PM
cocoy1805 cocoy1805 is offline
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

im not trying to compare a motorcycle straight up with a MTB.. what im wondering about is why didnt they go to 29er wheels when weight and rolling resistance wont be an issue because of the engine.. if a bigger wheel is better for rolling over rocks and rough terrain.. wouldnt that be a big advantage for motorcycles?

anyways thanks guys for all the info.. from what i have read here and on the net.. i think i will stick with my 26" MTB.
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Old 11-24-2012, 02:59 PM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

From what I know.. Some Motocross motorcycles use different size wheels. Usually larger diameter wheels up front to help absorb some of the trail/track. The rear wheel can be smaller than the front for more torque.

I would further think that motorcycles dont really do much technical trail riding with roots and rocks. Even if they did, they would feel it less than bicycles because they carry so much weight and their suspension is designed for the weight and power of the motor. In a bicycle there is a greater importance to weight and performance where motorcycles look towards more power than weight to get performance.
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Old 11-24-2012, 03:21 PM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

Note that the biggest proponents of 29ers are Matatangkad na puti ...
According to some of my (former) officemates, too small for them yung 26er ...

So I guess geometry din ang. Isa sa reason...
In my case, kung naging standard nga lang ang 24er, baka yun ang preference ko hehehe
  #10  
Old 11-24-2012, 04:25 PM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

how about:

try a 29er bike for yourself for at least 5 trail rides and go back to your 26er?
at least you'll get the answer on your own.

i dont know much about motorcycles, but back in the 1980s, 13 inch rims were the ones to own. now, 17 inch rims are the defacto standard for compact cars. am i missing something here?
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Old 11-24-2012, 08:24 PM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

Motorcycles need lower center of gravity for stability specially during high speeds thus wheels cant be much bigger. Also when making full stops, riders have to support their bikes with both feet while sitting on the motorcycle seats, so smaller wheels will be more convenient. Have you seen a motorbiker standing over during these full stops?
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  #12  
Old 11-24-2012, 10:02 PM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

Quote:
Originally Posted by cocoy1805 View Post

i have read and seen comparisons on the 26" vs 29". im just wondering why hasnt the motorcyle world adopted the 26" or 29" wheels if indeed bigger is better?

is it because they dont need to worry about weight and acceleration problems? if indeed a 29er has better maneuverability, why hasnt the motrocross world switched?
That sure reads like a direct comparison to me.

Anyway, a lot of good points have been made in the above replies.

Ride one to find out. It's the only way.
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Old 11-24-2012, 10:21 PM
cocoy1805 cocoy1805 is offline
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

i guess it sounds like i was trying to make a direct comparison.. my bad.. i was just wondering why the motorcycle.. which i guess evolved from the bicycle never went the 29er way.. i guess the advantages and disadvantages lies on the fact that motorcycles have engines and MTBs have to be pedalled.. would that be a wrong assumption?

i havent tried a 29er MTB.. but have tried those generic bikes that are 29er.. now i dont think thats a good comparison heheh.

but thanks guys.. i guess we all have our reasons for choosing what size MTB we want..
  #14  
Old 11-24-2012, 10:55 PM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

No problem.

Pag 29er bike mo, the wheels and tires really make a difference. You have to invest more in good wheels compared to 26 bikes. Since the wheel is bigger, you can really feel extra weight, especially when climbing. Momentum is excellent in most scenarios, but acceleration can be really hard work.
  #15  
Old 11-25-2012, 03:11 PM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

@ACMI
What would be a good 29er wheels in terms of the number of spokes (36, 32, 28 or 24) for a general cross country rides? (rider weight is 170lbs)
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Old 11-25-2012, 09:42 PM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

Pag 29er ka you have an inherent weakness due a large wheel. A lot of forums abroad recommend 36 spokes but they are not practical since the rims and aftermarket hubs are hard to come by. If you will use a custom wheelset then definitely 32 spokes is the most practical and stronger in theory than 28 or 24 spoke wheels which are usually factory built wheelsets. What wheelset are you planning on building or buying?

I use 32 spoke custom wheels, I weigh 240+ lbs and I have broken one rim so far. To the credit of the Wheelsmith spokes, not one spoke broke, so maybe it was the fault of the rim and not the spoke count. The rim was a 6000 series allow rim which weighed 430 grams. I now use a 7000 series allow rim and it has held up well so far.

Kung 170 lbs ka lang puede ka pa sa mga bling na low spoke count wheels, but my recommendation is to stick to 32 spokes na lang for added insurance, and you can ride as hard as you want. Spares are also easier to come by. I am using wheelsmith and CN spokes. Both brands have been excellent so far.
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Old 11-25-2012, 11:15 PM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

sir newbie po ako sa 29er just bought a built 29er bike pinalitan ko agad ng mt55 wheelset 24spokes lang yun di po kaya ako magka problema sa wheelset? usually xc (road and trails) kami every weekend.
  #18  
Old 11-26-2012, 03:05 AM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

i think it also helps the 29er to feel better if you have bigger cassette like 11-36t specially on climbs. but an overall low resistance wheelset/hub is key
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Old 11-26-2012, 05:54 AM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

Quote:
Originally Posted by ACMI View Post
What wheelset are you planning on building or buying?

Kung 170 lbs ka lang puede ka pa sa mga bling na low spoke count wheels, but my recommendation is to stick to 32 spokes na lang for added insurance, and you can ride as hard as you want. Spares are also easier to come by. I am using wheelsmith and CN spokes. Both brands have been excellent so far.
Thank you for your valuable input. I currently use stock wheelset of Specialized, its with Alex rims with 36 spokes and am thinking of either building or buying a built one with a lower spoke count.
  #20  
Old 11-26-2012, 07:19 AM
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Default Re: personal curiosity about 29er..

Mr Cocoy, Some guys are absolutely correct.... but the best way for you still, is by personal trial.... Motox is a diff world than MTB.... Diameter of the wheel does affect it's durability... it's the material of the rim and number of spokes that distribute the weight of the impact... what affect the 29 wheels is a bit more added weight...

if you feel you dont like 29er at your first try... then stop it immediately, kasi you will end up on it.... like me ayaw ko na mag 26, di dahil sa mga dis anvan at advantages... nangawit na ako at nag eenjoy...

Goodluck and ride safe.. :-)
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