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  #1  
Old 05-04-2009, 08:53 PM
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Default Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

This question just popped after reading the thread, "does a high end bike really help?"... Having yet to ride a FS bike, I have my share of bone jarring rides with my current hardtail and sometimes it just dictates if it's a go or no go on certain portions of the trail...what are your thoughts folks?
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Old 05-04-2009, 10:17 PM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

hard tails are great climbers but it do not limit you to enjoy the way down medyo maalog nga lang hehe
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Old 05-05-2009, 12:30 AM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

on certain technical climbs, FS bikes climb better


what do you mean by "respect"?
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Old 05-05-2009, 01:22 AM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

honga naman what do you mean by "respect"?

anyway....i love my hardtail whitie vision, very effective lalo na sa mga climbs. i dont bother hitting the rough roads/trails since sanay naman akong tumayo on my rig. japormz nga eh. hehe!
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Old 05-05-2009, 01:25 AM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

I've ridden all kinds of bikes ... FS or HT of either XC, Trail, or even DH build and what I can say is ... each is a unique and different experience. FS is not necessarily better, or easier, or more comfortable etc and vice versa but just different. Having said that, I slightly prefer HTs because they are more fun - and I actually look for that "bone jarring" feel of connection of being "one" with the bike. Besides there is the unparalleled feeling of satisfaction when riding "technical FS only" trails on a HT.

As for respect for the trail ... I think my respect for the trail is the same whether on FS or HT. My motto is ride with confidence but also ride with the brain switched on. IMHO - the moment you underestimate and disrespect the trail (and that is any trail - even the road!) is a ticking timebomb that you will soon end up in a really bad crash very soon.
  #6  
Old 05-05-2009, 01:31 AM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

I'm guessing he meant "respect" in the sense that suspension in general allows you to attack uneven grounds with [more] impunity.

Siguro parang paghataw ng kotse in general. Pag maganda build/suspension, kahit sobrang bilis parang di mo nararamdaman - and makes you want to go even faster. Pero merong iba naman na pag mabilis feeling mo kakalas na yung kotse, and you tend to be more careful (hold the wheel with both hands, etc. etc.) hahahaha.

Having a hardtail myself, I can relate to the feeling when going down and feeling all the bumps at the rear.

Having said that, I guess speed nalang magiging issue non. I don't think you'll have to bail out on any portion of a trail short of a ravine just because it "feels too rough," ako personally I just make sure I modulate the brakes as best I could to keep my speed under control in such circumstances.
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Old 05-05-2009, 09:14 AM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

I treat a trail as a trail, respect is what I give to fellow mountain bikers. I have used my HT and FS on the same trail, the only difference that I feel is that when using the FS, I could ride a bit more careless about the line I'm choosing, whereas when using my HT, I pay attention to my lines, looking for areas where I could pump the bike for more speed. Sometimes when going downhill, I'm faster on my HT than on my FS, sometimes naman hinde.
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Old 05-05-2009, 10:33 AM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

i've raced with others on rigid bikes that completely trounced myself and other suspended riders.

as they zoom down the trails, it LOOKS like they have no regard for the trail, but i guess they've mastered it and have paid their respect to it long before the race.
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Old 05-05-2009, 11:35 AM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

After my 1-year long weekend rides with different type of riders on different trails i wanted to sum up that it is the riders skill that makes the difference.
Nowadays we share the same trails with single speeders on rigid fork. The better of them have zero dismount as compared to novice (just like me) riding on full-sus bikes. Yes, fork and shock travel aids in technical trail riding but an experience riders can rely on their arm and legs flex to absorb the ground imperfection and use body english to counter the the steepness of terrain.How i wish i could be like them. So its not respecting the trail it is enjoying your trail ride.
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Old 05-05-2009, 11:45 AM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

ht user here...in any sport, i guess, its always wise to know the limitations of your equipment.

but then i've seen what other peeps can do with their ht's at wala pa yata ako ako sa 1/4 duon.
  #11  
Old 05-05-2009, 11:50 AM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nargalzius View Post
I'm guessing he meant "respect" in the sense that suspension in general allows you to attack uneven grounds with [more] impunity.
Siguro parang paghataw ng kotse in general. Pag maganda build/suspension, kahit sobrang bilis parang di mo nararamdaman - and makes you want to go even faster. Pero merong iba naman na pag mabilis feeling mo kakalas na yung kotse, and you tend to be more careful (hold the wheel with both hands, etc. etc.) hahahaha.

Having a hardtail myself, I can relate to the feeling when going down and feeling all the bumps at the rear.

Having said that, I guess speed nalang magiging issue non. I don't think you'll have to bail out on any portion of a trail short of a ravine just because it "feels too rough," ako personally I just make sure I modulate the brakes as best I could to keep my speed under control in such circumstances.
Howdy Gentlemen!
Sorry for not clarifying the respect part, but Nargalzius has hit the nail on the head with what I meant when I started the thread. The responses are really great and I am happy that it has generated a lot of thought worth considering. I have been thrown offline many times on my HT because of the rough bouncing at the rear, including spills and also being put on a spot where I would normally stop and think twice before attacking it, but luckily, during those moments, I decide to ride it, come what may, here are some reasons why: because A, if I brake suddenly, I would end up eating rocks and roots and B if bail out of the bike, I would end up eating rocks and roots, so at a split second I just ride it out and much to my surprise I'd survive the obstacle! I am sure most of you guys feel the rush and the excitement after such incidents...
Well, to credit my HT, it has taught me to loosen up my legs, albeit tiring during long descents and and also make my survival mode kick in (scare factor), whether to ride the obstacle or not and many times I am thankful that I didn't take the risk, because I was well aware of my capabilities and the capabilities of my bike...but of course, I will not totally abandon the challenge, sabi nga, face your fears. Maybe I won't ride it now or tomorrow, but someday, when I become a better rider.
  #12  
Old 06-04-2009, 02:14 PM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

Hi Dennis. I've used my hardtai in many kinds of terrain and I have conquered most but crashed in some. The only kind of trail that I fear treading with my ht are the downhill tracks with all the big rocks strewn and large ruts present. I found out to my chagrin that my puny xc shock fork with 100-120mm travel just would not be able to conquer such extreme terrain, except maybe if I am too drunk to feel fear in which case a total debilitating crash would surely ensue. In last year's tlbf, a member of the national team was able to finish the whole dh track using his xc rig although he did not place in the standings. I've tried my ht and my fs in your backyard trails in Baguio and in both times I crashed in the same exact spot. Maybe the first one was purely my undoing but the second crash using my fs was because of fear creeping down my loins. So what I'm getting at is that it's really not the bike but the biker that makes a terrain ridable or not. Or as Bobet will say.."nasa indian yan wala sa pana.."
  #13  
Old 06-04-2009, 03:16 PM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

i reckon you are forced to learn to read the trail more on a hardtail. sa fs kasi you can get away with plowing through your usual technical terrain that would otherwise throw you off on an ht.
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Old 06-04-2009, 04:53 PM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

Hello Cowpatchman6,

I agree that riding a hardtail bike will definitely make a biker consider his line a little bit better than if he's riding a fulsus bike. There are a lot of stuff on the trail that a hardtail is just not meant to negotiate, but that's where the fun is, right? Riding downhill, especially, at a certain speed requires constant attention and quick decision-making, as you would know. It all just adds to the fun, at the same time this is one of those moments where "superman" is not a hero but a threat, and "faceplant" is often a mind-numbing collision with reality at the slightest failure to grant "respect" to the trail at hand.
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Old 06-06-2009, 05:58 AM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mangdugas08 View Post
Hi Dennis. I've used my hardtai in many kinds of terrain and I have conquered most but crashed in some. The only kind of trail that I fear treading with my ht are the downhill tracks with all the big rocks strewn and large ruts present. I found out to my chagrin that my puny xc shock fork with 100-120mm travel just would not be able to conquer such extreme terrain, except maybe if I am too drunk to feel fear in which case a total debilitating crash would surely ensue. In last year's tlbf, a member of the national team was able to finish the whole dh track using his xc rig although he did not place in the standings. I've tried my ht and my fs in your backyard trails in Baguio and in both times I crashed in the same exact spot. Maybe the first one was purely my undoing but the second crash using my fs was because of fear creeping down my loins. So what I'm getting at is that it's really not the bike but the biker that makes a terrain ridable or not. Or as Bobet will say.."nasa indian yan wala sa pana.."
Hello! Nice to hear from you Chito, thanks for sharing your thoughts on this and I guess Bobet's words ring true, in the months that I had been trailing around the neighborhood I have learned to respect my bike more knowing it's capabilities are very limited in our trails here, but I have oftentimes taken it to the limit with good results..I learned to loosen up and adapt to the changing terrain. I do agree that it is a very bumpy ride on a HT but I guess if you get used to the geometry of the bike, you can pretty much build around it and use it to your advantage, and that's where the "Indian" part comes in. Life gives you lemons, you make lemonade . I admit, I have a long shot in "mastering" the geometry of my bike, if there's such a thing...Of course I have tempted fate and stretched my bike's capabilities beyond what it was built for, crashed many times and got my share of aches and scrapes like all of us do here. I too had learned to respect our trails here, they are unforgiving, very... the humble pine tree root can cause a lot of damage if you get lucky enough to make a mistake, even the pine needles with their waxy coating when dry had made my hair stand on end on "what-could-have- been" situations out on the trail. Now, will I be a better rider when I ride on an FS bike for the first time? I guess not, I will have to get used to it and maybe start from scratch, I will have to adjust to the different nuances or personalities that an FS bike would have. Will it make me more confident? Maybe not (maybe I'll be scared putting a dent on the bike ) the trail I'll be riding will pretty much be the same way I left it before riding the FS bike through it. The fear will still be there on certain sections, but will I give it a shot and try to overcome them? Definitely! Let me muster the courage first...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hypercreed View Post
Hello Cowpatchman6,

I agree that riding a hardtail bike will definitely make a biker consider his line a little bit better than if he's riding a fulsus bike. There are a lot of stuff on the trail that a hardtail is just not meant to negotiate, but that's where the fun is, right? Riding downhill, especially, at a certain speed requires constant attention and quick decision-making, as you would know. It all just adds to the fun, at the same time this is one of those moments where "superman" is not a hero but a threat, and "faceplant" is often a mind-numbing collision with reality at the slightest failure to grant "respect" to the trail at hand.
True enough, at certain trail sections, it makes you think twice...My HT taught me a lot on being cautious at certain sections, but sometimes I breathe in just give it a go...risky? Yes...stupid?...Yes...Worth it?...Yes and No...Fun?...Hell YEAH!...
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Last edited by cowpatchman6; 06-06-2009 at 06:12 AM. Reason: Automerge, please use EDIT button to ADD/EDIT your recent post.
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Old 06-06-2009, 07:06 AM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

For me it's just the comfort. Phsychologically our mind pushes or convinces us to be more daring pag nka FS tayo. But whether I use a HT or an FS bike I still study the terrain. SAFETY must always be considered whether you're on the road or on the trail. I want to experience that adrenaline rush over and over again. I want the fulfillment everytime I conquered a difficult course or a long travel. So for me "RESPECT" must always be practiced wherever you are and wherever you go. Tama ba mga sir
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Old 06-06-2009, 06:53 PM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

[quote=mapora;169691]For me it's just the comfort. Phsychologically our mind pushes or convinces us to be more daring pag nka FS tayo. But whether I use a HT or an FS bike I still study the terrain. SAFETY must always be considered whether you're on the road or on the trail. I want to experience that adrenaline rush over and over again. I want the fulfillment everytime I conquered a difficult course or a long travel. So for me "RESPECT" must always be practiced wherever you are and wherever you go. Tama ba mga sir [/QUOTE]

TAMA!
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Old 01-19-2010, 11:28 PM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

I love my hardtail, feel na feel mo ang track. Lalo na pag mabilisang downhill tas rough road. Panalo! One time on our way to Madlum caves (Bulacan), may part dun na pababa, sa sobrang pagod, di' na ko tumayo sa saddle, ayun, nakalog si Man*%#... pag dating sa baba, hinto muna ako sabay sabi "syet, nilabasan ata ako dun ah"... Peace mga bro and sis!!!
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Old 01-20-2010, 09:45 AM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

I have not experienced FS bike but I heard from a rider who had that hard tail are more efficient bike especially climbing because every stroke of pedaling translate to power whereas for a FS bike, even if the rear suspension is fully locked, there is still some power loss. Going downhill in rough trail is no problem either in a hard tail bike, you only have to use your legs as shocks which every experienced mt. bikers know how. Moreover, maintenance wise, HT bike are simpler to maintain. Cost wise, it is less expensive too.

In my humble opinion (IMHO), FS bikes are great for all mountain type of riding meaning riding gnarly trails and terrains. On the other hand, HT bikes are great for cross country on smooth to medium rough trails or even cemented road.
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Old 10-19-2010, 11:23 PM
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Default Re: Does a hardtail bike make you respect the trail a bit more?

mas skilled mga naka HT or Rigid mtb pag nasa trails.
suspension bikes are way too overhype. yeah they look cool and really
helpful on technical downhills but not everybody wanna zoom down a mountain
at 60-80 kph...we let the pros and extreme bikers do that hehe...and most people just wanna own and
ride FS bikes...only to learn in the long run that HT or Rigid bikes are way better, reliable, less maintenance, lighter and more responsive for all around riding.
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